Flopper Stopper Solutions for F32 (Hoyt)?

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Flopper Stopper Solutions for F32 (Hoyt)?

Postby mtryon » Fri Jul 13, 2012 3:53 pm

I'm just about ready to get my F32 out to the Channel Islands off Southern California. There are some pretty rolly anchorages out there. On my previous boats (Morgan 41 "Classic", Rawson 30) I was simply able to pole-out a flooper stopper off the spinnaker pole and main boom. However, I don't want my CF mast to be constantly loaded and unloaded taking the loads of the flopper stopper off the end of my main boom. Does anyone have any other solutions they have worked out using a flopper stopper? I was thinking maybe "two", one off each toe rail might be better than nothing. Any ideas or experience will be much appreciated. Thanks

Marty
Freedom 32 - Hull #15 - "BAMBOLEO" - Southern California, USA
Morgan 41 CC "Classic" - 10 year live-aboard
Rawson 30 - "La Cabriole" - Circumnavigator -- but not by me... :(
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Re: Flopper Stopper Solutions for F32 (Hoyt)?

Postby mtryon » Fri Jul 20, 2012 3:55 am

Well... I think I had an epiphany. What I may try is very simple and I don't know why I didn't think of it right off.
I am going to construct a simple boom crutch out of 304 stainless tubing. I will work out the locations as to exactly where it goes but it will be something like this; I will swing the mainsail boom outboard to as near a right angle to the hull as I can get, and then put this new "boom crutch" directly under the boom where a dropped plumb bob would intersect the toe rail. The boom crutch will have fittings to lock on to the toe rail and the boom. Then all I need is a foreguy and afterguy for the main boom. Or...if I make the boom crutch with two legs in an upside down Vee then I won't need any guys at all. That should do it. Most of the flopper stopper's load will be taken by the side of the boat and the boom crutch. I haven't done the leverage math yet, but it looks like the mast goose neck will only take half the load of the boom crutch, and there should be NO flexing of the mast as there is no load taken above the goose neck as there would be with some sort of topping lift arrangement. Fingers crossed that this will work. Time will tell. If anyone has any engineering thoughts I would appreciate input.

Thanks!

Marty
Freedom 32 - Hull #15 - "BAMBOLEO" - Southern California, USA
Morgan 41 CC "Classic" - 10 year live-aboard
Rawson 30 - "La Cabriole" - Circumnavigator -- but not by me... :(
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Re: Flopper Stopper Solutions for F32 (Hoyt)?

Postby GeoffSchultz » Fri Jul 20, 2012 5:49 am

First off I think that the reason that you didn't get a reply is that the majority of Freedom owners are on the east coast and flopper-stoppers aren't common as we don't have as many issues with swell as west coast boaters do.

Having said that, I think that, I think that your plan is OK. My biggest concern would be the amount of weight that you have extended at a right angle to the boat and if that would exacerbate the roll. Other than that, it sounds good. Please let us know how it turns out as I have an interest in this.

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Re: Flopper Stopper Solutions for F32 (Hoyt)?

Postby mtryon » Mon Jul 23, 2012 1:18 pm

Thanks for your response Geoff,
Yes, we are lonely Freedom owners out here on the left coast it seems! Not many Freedoms around here! LOL...

The more I think about using the Flopper Stopper in the manner I described the better I like the idea. As far as causing more roll by having that weight outboard; it's the typical way all boats do this. They either pole it out with the spinnaker pole (much less weight) or the main boom. I DO know I will be putting it out on the port side because the Freedom 32 has a sort of built in list to starboard when the water tanks are full.

Thanks agian,

Marty
Freedom 32 - Hull #15 - "BAMBOLEO" - Southern California, USA
Morgan 41 CC "Classic" - 10 year live-aboard
Rawson 30 - "La Cabriole" - Circumnavigator -- but not by me... :(
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Re: Flopper Stopper Solutions for F32 (Hoyt)?

Postby Rick Simonds » Mon Jul 23, 2012 4:27 pm

Someone gave me some flopper stoppers and, quite honetly, they're buried somewhere, I've never used them even once, so take this as just a seat-of-the-pants feel for this, I didn't calculate anything, but I'd just use the main boom lazy jacks instead of the crutch and use simple rope guys to hold the boom in place.

The crutch right under the boom, with no other support, the boom just entirely cantilevered out by itself about 8 feet or so, would make me nervous. The crutch would end up, say, about 1/3 of the way along the boom, a point load in a good place to risk bending and kinking the boom from the leverage of the flopper stopper getting pulled up particularly vigorosly (think of it like bending a fishing pole when pulling up hard on a really big fish.)

Swinging the boom out and using it for the flopper stopper is OK but I'd at least firmly tighten the lazy jacks when using it. It does put the force into the mast, something you said you didn't want to do, but, to me, that's preferable to putting a very-long-lever bending force purely on the aluminum boom extrusion, and using the lazy jacks instead of the main halyard would put the load in a lower, stiffer part of the mast, a part that would very easily handle the load.

And, really, once you're tightening the lazy jacks anyway, you sorta don't need the crutch any more.
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Re: Flopper Stopper Solutions for F32 (Hoyt)?

Postby mtryon » Tue Jul 24, 2012 12:15 am

Hey Rick,

Thanks for your input on the flopper stoppers. I think you raise some great points. The only thing I never considered is use of the lazy jacks. Mine are really spindly...and look very light weight, including the blocks. I'll take a more serious look at them and their load capacity...including the blocks. If you are correct, and most likely you are, then this is a good solution to my problem. ....and I agree...the load frequency of the load/unload on the mast at the point where the lazy jacks are attached to the thicher section of the mast is much less of a problem than the loading/unloading oscillating at the very flexible masthead. (which was a huge concern for me). Also, and I failed to mention this, I have a Garhauer rigid boom vang which can also assist in taking up the load so I think your solution is well founded.

Thanks again for a great post.

Marty
Freedom 32 - Hull #15 - "BAMBOLEO" - Southern California, USA
Morgan 41 CC "Classic" - 10 year live-aboard
Rawson 30 - "La Cabriole" - Circumnavigator -- but not by me... :(
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Re: Flopper Stopper Solutions for F32 (Hoyt)?

Postby freedomrider » Sat Jul 12, 2014 7:41 pm

Hi Marty-

Just my $.02, but a boom crutch might not be a good idea. When the boom is pulling up on the flopper stopper the boom would act as a lever with the crutch acting as the fulcrum. This would act to pull your mast out of the boat. Granted, there is the L bracket thingy to hold the mast from rotating, but why stress it unnecessarily? I like Ricks suggestion of using the lazy jacks though. I don't see anything wrong with using the main halyard attached to the end of the boom. The mast takes far more loading from the mainsail when underway.

Please let us all know what you finally do. I'm heading to Mexico next year and will have a lopper stopper.

Dave Calhoun
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Hoyt F32
San Francisco Bay
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Re: Flopper Stopper Solutions for F32 (Hoyt)?

Postby mtryon » Sun Jul 13, 2014 1:16 pm

Hi Dave,
This post was from a couple of years ago, but yes... the boom crutch was a bad idea and you raise yet another strong point for not doing it. What a crazy thing that would be to all of a sudden see your mast sliding up and down the deck hole as the boat rolled. The worst! So now, I will just be using the main halyard off the end of the boom idea. Hey! When you head south next year give me a holler here on the forum and if you pass through San Diego would love to get together and talk "32's". From what I see there are very few of us out here on the left coast. I'd really be interested to see how you have your boat outfitted for the cruise. I've been doing a lot of work on my F32. Removed the 30+ year old diesel and installed a 10.5 KW 48 volt electric propulsion system which is not quite done yet. (50 mile range using LiFePO4 batteries). Also have a Maxwell windlass and a water maker sitting in boxes that need to get installed. The list never ends does it!.

Cheers!

Martin
PS--good luck with the never ending "to do" list for the cruise... ;-)
Freedom 32 - Hull #15 - "BAMBOLEO" - Southern California, USA
Morgan 41 CC "Classic" - 10 year live-aboard
Rawson 30 - "La Cabriole" - Circumnavigator -- but not by me... :(
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Re: Flopper Stopper Solutions for F32 (Hoyt)?

Postby GeoffSchultz » Mon Jul 14, 2014 6:32 am

We just finished 4 years of cruising on the Pacific side of Central America and were VERY happy to have a flopper stopper. Unfortunately both our original and replacement flopper stopper were stolen while deployed...Other than that they worked great and I wouldn't want to cruise without one. We simply deployed it at the end of the boom using the main halyard as a topping lift. No apparent issues. We could set/retrieve it in less than 5 minutes.

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Re: Flopper Stopper Solutions for F32 (Hoyt)?

Postby rds » Tue Jul 15, 2014 9:23 am

Marty, here is just a slight extension to Rick’s idea.
You may try some sort of sleeve wrapped around the mast connected to the rope going to the end of the boom. The sleeve is secured with halyard at the height of your choice . (idea is similar to main sheet traveler with control lines). This way you do not load mast tip excessively, you can adjust the height of the sleeve choosing thicker section of the mast while spreading the load around the mast with the sleeve and avoiding extra local load on lazy jack’s connection point to the mast (in my case it is wire going around the mast and thru just one eye strap with two rivets ),
also crutch takes extra storage room while not in use .
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