Electrolysis onF-28

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1

Posted by brucestrt (brucestrt@…>)

Just purchased a Mull 28 in Los Angeles in generally excellent
condition. Only two problems so far. First, when hauled for survey
there was what appeared to be corrosion on the keel near the bottom
and zincs were in need of replacement. Today the boats diver informed
me that the boat has been eating zincs at an unusual pace for at least
a couple years or more and the p/o simply replaced them, every one or
two months. the boat had bad gel batteries which have been replaced
with wet cells but doubt this was the problem. The boat normally does
not have shore power connected. Second problem was some dry rot under
the main bulkhead due to fresh water in the bottom of the mast and
what appeared to be a plugged up drain from mast to bilge. Foreward
two feet of teak and holly sole will have to be replaced and some
epoxy used under the head area. Cannot see the mast base. Is either
of these problems likely to be affecting the carbon mast? Any
comments or suggestions weill be appreciated. Excuse the long first
message.

Bruce

2

Posted by Lorman, Alvin J. (ajlorman@…>)

Bruce:

Welcome to the Freedom family.

I’m no expert in marine electric, but I doubt that your keel, which is lead, is experiencing corrosion. Eating zincs is a different problem. You cold a multimeter to see if any of the electrical circuits are 'leaking" when in the off position. Also, make sure that everything that is supposed to be grounded is grounded. If the boat is docked in a particularly electrically “hot” area, you might try one of the zinc fishes that clip onto your grounding system and then go overboard.

Al Lorman
F30 Ab Initio

-----Original Message-----From: freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com [mailto:freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of brucestrtSent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 8:00 PMTo: freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.comSubject: [freedomyachts2003] Electrolysis onF-28Just purchased a Mull 28 in Los Angeles in generally excellentcondition. Only two problems so far. First, when hauled for surveythere was what appeared to be corrosion on the keel near the bottomand zincs were in need of replacement. Today the boats diver informedme that the boat has been eating zincs at an unusual pace for at leasta couple years or more and the p/o simply replaced them, every one ortwo months. the boat had bad gel batteries which have been replacedwith wet cells but doubt this was the problem. The boat normally doesnot have shore power connected. Second problem was some dry rot underthe main bulkhead due to fresh water in the bottom of the mast andwhat appeared to be a plugged up drain from mast to bilge. Forewardtwo feet of teak and holly sole will have to be replaced and someepoxy used under the head area. Cannot see the mast base. Is eitherof these problems likely to be affecting the carbon mast? Anycomments or suggestions weill be appreciated. Excuse the long firstmessage.Bruce
=00IRS CIRCULAR 230 NOTICE. Any advice expressed above as to tax matters was neither written nor intended by the sender or Mayer, Brown, Rowe Maw LLP to be used and cannot be used by any taxpayer for the purpose of avoiding tax penalties that may be imposed under U.S. tax law. If any person uses or refers to any such tax advice in promoting, marketing or recommending a partnership or other entity, investment plan or arrangement to any taxpayer, then (i) the advice was written to support the promotion or marketing (by a person other than Mayer, Brown, Rowe Maw LLP) of that transaction or matter, and (ii) such taxpayer should seek advice based on the taxpayers particular circumstances from an independent tax advisorThis email and any files transmitted with it are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail.

3

Posted by Michel Capel (mike_c_f35ck@…>)

Lead is not that far from zinc on the galvanic ladder, so if zincs
are eaten quickly, I wouldn’t be surprised that lead is also nibbled
at. Strange though that the boat is usually not connected to
shorepower and still has electrolysis going on. Is the boat berthed
close to a steel quayside? If so, the quayside could be protected
against corrosion with an active system. If this is the case, I
would move the boat away, because no matter what you do, electric
currents will remain running around the boat.

Perhaps connecting the shore power - provided there’s a good
galvanic isolation in the system - could improve the situation.

good luck,
Michel

— In freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com, “Lorman, Alvin J.”
<ajlorman@…> wrote:

Bruce:

Welcome to the Freedom family.

I’m no expert in marine electric, but I doubt that your keel,
which is
lead, is experiencing corrosion. Eating zincs is a different
problem.
You cold a multimeter to see if any of the electrical circuits are
'leaking" when in the off position. Also, make sure that
everything
that is supposed to be grounded is grounded. If the boat is
docked in a
particularly electrically “hot” area, you might try one of the zinc
fishes that clip onto your grounding system and then go overboard.

Al Lorman
F30 Ab Initio

-----Original Message-----
From: freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of brucestrt
Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 8:00 PM
To: freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [freedomyachts2003] Electrolysis onF-28

Just purchased a Mull 28 in Los Angeles in generally excellent
condition. Only two problems so far. First, when hauled for
survey
there was what appeared to be corrosion on the keel near the bottom
and zincs were in need of replacement. Today the boats diver
informed
me that the boat has been eating zincs at an unusual pace for at
least
a couple years or more and the p/o simply replaced them, every one
or
two months. the boat had bad gel batteries which have been
replaced
with wet cells but doubt this was the problem. The boat normally
does
not have shore power connected. Second problem was some dry rot
under
the main bulkhead due to fresh water in the bottom of the mast and
what appeared to be a plugged up drain from mast to bilge.
Foreward
two feet of teak and holly sole will have to be replaced and some
epoxy used under the head area. Cannot see the mast base. Is
either
of these problems likely to be affecting the carbon mast? Any
comments or suggestions weill be appreciated. Excuse the long
first
message.

Bruce

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IRS CIRCULAR 230 NOTICE. Any advice expressed above as to tax
matters was neither written nor intended by the sender or Mayer,
Brown, Rowe & Maw LLP to be used and cannot be used by any taxpayer
for the purpose of avoiding tax penalties that may be imposed under
U.S. tax law. If any person uses or refers to any such tax advice in
promoting, marketing or recommending a partnership or other entity,
investment plan or arrangement to any taxpayer, then (i) the advice
was written to support the promotion or marketing (by a person other
than Mayer, Brown, Rowe & Maw LLP) of that transaction or matter,
and (ii) such taxpayer should seek advice based on the taxpayers
particular circumstances from an independent tax advisor

This email and any files transmitted with it are intended solely
for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
If you have received this email in error please notify the system
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disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail.

4

Posted by brucestrt (brucestrt@…>)

Thanks for the info Al. Didn’t think the lead keel shoud be a problem
but it did have bubbled paint on the bottom area which the yard had to
sand off before bottom painting. Guess it’s time to get a multi-meter
and start checking things out. Were the the shaft and strut bonded
on new Freedoms? Normally I would prefer each to be separate and
depend on its own zinc.
Bruce

5

Posted by brucestrt (brucestrt@…>)

NOt bethed near a steel quayside or anything like that. Near the end
of a dock in Cabrillo Marina in San Pedro. Diver did say that a motor
yacht on the end tie also seemed to be eating zincs more than normal.
Thanks for the responses
Bruce

— In freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com, “Michel Capel”
<mike_c_f35ck@…> wrote:

Lead is not that far from zinc on the galvanic ladder, so if zincs
are eaten quickly, I wouldn’t be surprised that lead is also nibbled
at. Strange though that the boat is usually not connected to
shorepower and still has electrolysis going on. Is the boat berthed
close to a steel quayside? If so, the quayside could be protected
against corrosion with an active system. If this is the case, I
would move the boat away, because no matter what you do, electric
currents will remain running around the boat.

Perhaps connecting the shore power - provided there’s a good
galvanic isolation in the system - could improve the situation.

good luck,
Michel

— In freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com, “Lorman, Alvin J.”
<ajlorman@> wrote:

Bruce:

Welcome to the Freedom family.

I’m no expert in marine electric, but I doubt that your keel,
which is
lead, is experiencing corrosion. Eating zincs is a different
problem.
You cold a multimeter to see if any of the electrical circuits are
'leaking" when in the off position. Also, make sure that
everything
that is supposed to be grounded is grounded. If the boat is
docked in a
particularly electrically “hot” area, you might try one of the zinc
fishes that clip onto your grounding system and then go overboard.

Al Lorman
F30 Ab Initio

-----Original Message-----
From: freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of brucestrt
Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2006 8:00 PM
To: freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [freedomyachts2003] Electrolysis onF-28

Just purchased a Mull 28 in Los Angeles in generally excellent
condition. Only two problems so far. First, when hauled for
survey
there was what appeared to be corrosion on the keel near the bottom
and zincs were in need of replacement. Today the boats diver
informed
me that the boat has been eating zincs at an unusual pace for at
least
a couple years or more and the p/o simply replaced them, every one
or
two months. the boat had bad gel batteries which have been
replaced
with wet cells but doubt this was the problem. The boat normally
does
not have shore power connected. Second problem was some dry rot
under
the main bulkhead due to fresh water in the bottom of the mast and
what appeared to be a plugged up drain from mast to bilge.
Foreward
two feet of teak and holly sole will have to be replaced and some
epoxy used under the head area. Cannot see the mast base. Is
either
of these problems likely to be affecting the carbon mast? Any
comments or suggestions weill be appreciated. Excuse the long
first
message.

Bruce

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IRS CIRCULAR 230 NOTICE. Any advice expressed above as to tax
matters was neither written nor intended by the sender or Mayer,
Brown, Rowe & Maw LLP to be used and cannot be used by any taxpayer
for the purpose of avoiding tax penalties that may be imposed under
U.S. tax law. If any person uses or refers to any such tax advice in
promoting, marketing or recommending a partnership or other entity,
investment plan or arrangement to any taxpayer, then (i) the advice
was written to support the promotion or marketing (by a person other
than Mayer, Brown, Rowe & Maw LLP) of that transaction or matter,
and (ii) such taxpayer should seek advice based on the taxpayers
particular circumstances from an independent tax advisor

This email and any files transmitted with it are intended solely
for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed.
If you have received this email in error please notify the system
manager. If you are not the named addressee you should not
disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail.

6

Posted by Lorman, Alvin J. (ajlorman@…>)

Bruce:

I don’t know whether the shaft and strut are bonded. Mercifully, my F30 has had few electrolysis issues (compared to my prior Sabre, which ate zincs).

Al

-----Original Message-----From: freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com [mailto:freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of brucestrtSent: Friday, February 10, 2006 10:56 PMTo: freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.comSubject: [freedomyachts2003] Re: Electrolysis onF-28Thanks for the info Al. Didn’t think the lead keel shoud be a problembut it did have bubbled paint on the bottom area which the yard had tosand off before bottom painting. Guess it’s time to get a multi-meterand start checking things out. Were the the shaft and strut bondedon new Freedoms? Normally I would prefer each to be separate anddepend on its own zinc.Bruce
=00IRS CIRCULAR 230 NOTICE. Any advice expressed above as to tax matters was neither written nor intended by the sender or Mayer, Brown, Rowe Maw LLP to be used and cannot be used by any taxpayer for the purpose of avoiding tax penalties that may be imposed under U.S. tax law. If any person uses or refers to any such tax advice in promoting, marketing or recommending a partnership or other entity, investment plan or arrangement to any taxpayer, then (i) the advice was written to support the promotion or marketing (by a person other than Mayer, Brown, Rowe Maw LLP) of that transaction or matter, and (ii) such taxpayer should seek advice based on the taxpayers particular circumstances from an independent tax advisorThis email and any files transmitted with it are intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. If you are not the named addressee you should not disseminate, distribute or copy this e-mail.

7

Posted by Folia Grace (fgrace2000@…>)

Bruce,

Had the same problem on F36. Epoxy coated the Keel lead and solved
the problem. Yard recommnended glassing over the keel lead, but I
did not go that far.

Regards,

Van
— In freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com, “brucestrt”
<brucestrt@…> wrote:

Just purchased a Mull 28 in Los Angeles in generally excellent
condition. Only two problems so far. First, when hauled for
survey
there was what appeared to be corrosion on the keel near the bottom
and zincs were in need of replacement. Today the boats diver
informed
me that the boat has been eating zincs at an unusual pace for at
least
a couple years or more and the p/o simply replaced them, every one
or
two months. the boat had bad gel batteries which have been
replaced
with wet cells but doubt this was the problem. The boat normally
does
not have shore power connected. Second problem was some dry rot
under
the main bulkhead due to fresh water in the bottom of the mast and
what appeared to be a plugged up drain from mast to bilge.
Foreward
two feet of teak and holly sole will have to be replaced and some
epoxy used under the head area. Cannot see the mast base. Is
either
of these problems likely to be affecting the carbon mast? Any
comments or suggestions weill be appreciated. Excuse the long
first
message.

Bruce