Fantasy of trade-in toward a Freedom

Edward_Reiss · April 18, 2007, 1:47pm

Posted by Edward Reiss (ereiss@…>)

This could be a fairytale dream of mine. I used to own a F36 and wish to get back to a Freedom (38?) as my SO would enjoy her sailing activities much more in a stiffer boat and without the feeling of urgency and stress that she gets every time we tack.

The major impediment to moving up is I have a wonderful Pearson 33-2 and overcoming the inertia to put it on the market and manage that stress. This keeps me from moving forward. I have spoken with a couple of brokers who represent 36 or 38s about trading my boat and am informed that my boat is worth only 60% of what I paid for it 3 years ago (despite many $$$ improvements).

My head says that since everyone needs to make $ in a transaction the only way to do this is to sell my boat first and then explore Freedoms. Tell me I’m wrong but I fear I’m right.

Ed (a future Freedom owner)

michel.capel · April 18, 2007, 2:55pm

Posted by michel.capel (michel.capel@…>)

Ed,

It’s a tradeoff whether to trade in or sell yourself. If you trade
in, it costs you money but saves you a lot of trouble. You might
also try to offer a Freedom broker who has an F38 you like if he’s
interested in selling your boat first. You might save on his fee.

— In FreedomOwnersGroup@yahoogroups.com, “Edward Reiss”
<ereiss@…> wrote:

This could be a fairytale dream of mine. I used to own a F36 and
wish to
get back to a Freedom (38?) as my SO would enjoy her sailing
activities much
more in a stiffer boat and without the feeling of urgency and
stress that
she gets every time we tack.

The major impediment to moving up is I have a wonderful Pearson 33-
2 and
overcoming the inertia to put it on the market and manage that
stress. This keeps me from moving forward. I have spoken with a
couple of
brokers who represent 36 or 38s about trading my boat and am
informed that
my boat is worth only 60% of what I paid for it 3 years ago
(despite many
$$$ improvements).

My head says that since everyone needs to make $ in a transaction
the only
way to do this is to sell my boat first and then explore Freedoms.
Tell me
I’m wrong but I fear I’m right.

Ed (a future Freedom owner)

lance_ryley · April 18, 2007, 7:48pm

Posted by lance_ryley (lance_ryley@…>)

Ed,
I don’t buy that argument from a yacht broker any more than I buy it
from a car dealer. The boat is worth what someone is willing to pay
for it. If the vessel’s in good condition, you’ve maintained and
upgraded systems, and the hull isn’t falling apart (it’s a Pearson,
so I doubt you have any hull worries), then it’s just a matter of
finding the person who says “that is the boat for me.” I don’t know
what you paid for yours, and I don’t know what they told you yours
was worth, but a very very quick check on yachtworld shows 3 33-2’s
ranging from $50 - $55k.

A compromise to consider is to do some inexpensive self-marketing of
your current boat. Accept that you may be boat-less for a little
while if the Pearson sells. Budget about $500 for advertising in
places like Good Old Boat and Soundings, Boat US and a few others.
Build a simple website at a cheap hosting place with some nice
pictures, and see what happens. Give yourself 6 months. If nothing
happens and you have that itch to get into a Freedom (who can blame
you??), then talk to a broker. talk to people who have recently
bought or sold to see who they like. $500 outlay, even if no solid
results are ever realized, is still better than the 10% you are going
to give up to a broker.

That’s just my 2cts, but I think it’s entirely possible for you to do
something like that and get good results.

Lance
Bright Star
— In FreedomOwnersGroup@yahoogroups.com, “Edward Reiss”
<ereiss@…> wrote:

This could be a fairytale dream of mine. I used to own a F36 and
wish to
get back to a Freedom (38?) as my SO would enjoy her sailing
activities much
more in a stiffer boat and without the feeling of urgency and
stress that
she gets every time we tack.

The major impediment to moving up is I have a wonderful Pearson 33-
2 and
overcoming the inertia to put it on the market and manage that
stress. This keeps me from moving forward. I have spoken with a
couple of
brokers who represent 36 or 38s about trading my boat and am
informed that
my boat is worth only 60% of what I paid for it 3 years ago
(despite many
$$$ improvements).

My head says that since everyone needs to make $ in a transaction
the only
way to do this is to sell my boat first and then explore Freedoms.
Tell me
I’m wrong but I fear I’m right.

Ed (a future Freedom owner)

Alan_Kusinitz · April 18, 2007, 8:50pm

Posted by Alan Kusinitz (akusinitz@…>)

I bought my F-33 direct from the previous
owner who had set up a website. When I did a search for Freedom 33 it showed
up. Of course I considered many others on boats.com etc. but actually felt
better dealing directly with the owner.
Alan

From: FreedomOwnersGroup@yahoogroups.com [mailto:FreedomOwnersGroup@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of lance_ryley
Sent: Wednesday, April 18, 2007
3:48 PM
To: FreedomOwnersGroup@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [FreedomOwnersGroup] Re:
Fantasy of trade-in toward a Freedom

Ed,
I don’t buy that argument from a yacht broker any more than I buy it
from a car dealer. The boat is worth what someone is willing to pay
for it. If the vessel’s in good condition, you’ve maintained and
upgraded systems, and the hull isn’t falling apart (it’s a Pearson,
so I doubt you have any hull worries), then it’s just a matter of
finding the person who says “that is the boat for me.” I don’t know
what you paid for yours, and I don’t know what they told you yours
was worth, but a very very quick check on yachtworld shows 3 33-2’s
ranging from $50 - $55k.

A compromise to consider is to do some inexpensive self-marketing of
your current boat. Accept that you may be boat-less for a little
while if the Pearson sells. Budget about $500 for advertising in
places like Good Old Boat and Soundings, Boat US and a few others.
Build a simple website at a cheap hosting place with some nice
pictures, and see what happens. Give yourself 6 months. If nothing
happens and you have that itch to get into a Freedom (who can blame
you??), then talk to a broker. talk to people who have recently
bought or sold to see who they like. $500 outlay, even if no solid
results are ever realized, is still better than the 10% you are going
to give up to a broker.

That’s just my 2cts, but I think it’s entirely possible for you to do
something like that and get good results.

Lance
Bright Star
— In FreedomOwnersGroup@yahoogroups.com,
“Edward Reiss”
<ereiss@…> wrote:

This could be a fairytale dream of mine. I used to own a F36 and
wish to
get back to a Freedom (38?) as my SO would enjoy her sailing
activities much
more in a stiffer boat and without the feeling of urgency and
stress that
she gets every time we tack.

The major impediment to moving up is I have a wonderful Pearson 33-
2 and
overcoming the inertia to put it on the market and manage that
stress. This keeps me from moving forward. I have spoken with a
couple of
brokers who represent 36 or 38s about trading my boat and am
informed that
my boat is worth only 60% of what I paid for it 3 years ago
(despite many
$$$ improvements).

My head says that since everyone needs to make $ in a transaction
the only
way to do this is to sell my boat first and then explore Freedoms.
Tell me
I’m wrong but I fear I’m right.

Ed (a future Freedom owner)

\

sailorvela · April 24, 2007, 4:01pm

Posted by sailorvela (sailorvela@…>)

Hi Ed,

I’am on the same boat (pun). I am trying to get into a Freedom 40 CK,
but I also must sell my current boat an Iroquois Catamaran. Since I
long to get into the new boat, I decided to list it with our local
broker and price it agressively to sell
(http://www.yachtworld.com/core/listing/boatFullDetails.jsp?
boat_id=1696136&ybw=&units=Feet&currency=USD&access=Public&listing_id=
56149&url=). I felt I needed the extra coverage to move the boat.
Yep, I am losing money on it. It is a boat isnt it?

Best of luck with the sale of your Pearson.

Alex (another future Freedom owner)

— In FreedomOwnersGroup@yahoogroups.com, “Edward Reiss”
<ereiss@…> wrote:

This could be a fairytale dream of mine. I used to own a F36 and
wish to
get back to a Freedom (38?) as my SO would enjoy her sailing
activities much
more in a stiffer boat and without the feeling of urgency and
stress that
she gets every time we tack.

The major impediment to moving up is I have a wonderful Pearson 33-
2 and
overcoming the inertia to put it on the market and manage that
stress. This keeps me from moving forward. I have spoken with a
couple of
brokers who represent 36 or 38s about trading my boat and am
informed that
my boat is worth only 60% of what I paid for it 3 years ago
(despite many
$$$ improvements).

My head says that since everyone needs to make $ in a transaction
the only
way to do this is to sell my boat first and then explore Freedoms.
Tell me
I’m wrong but I fear I’m right.

Ed (a future Freedom owner)

Dave_Benjamin · April 24, 2007, 8:05pm

Posted by Dave_Benjamin (dave_benjamin@…>)

Edward,

Sell the Pearson yourself. 90% plus of the brokers should be avoided.
The good ones are far and few between.
Unless you grossly overpaid for your Pearson you should be able to
recover a good portion of what you paid.
I would sell the Pearson now going into summer and then look for a
Freedom after the season. Winter prices are usually lower.

— In FreedomOwnersGroup@yahoogroups.com, “Edward Reiss”
<ereiss@…> wrote:

This could be a fairytale dream of mine. I used to own a F36 and
wish to
get back to a Freedom (38?) as my SO would enjoy her sailing
activities much
more in a stiffer boat and without the feeling of urgency and
stress that
she gets every time we tack.

The major impediment to moving up is I have a wonderful Pearson 33-
2 and
overcoming the inertia to put it on the market and manage that
stress. This keeps me from moving forward. I have spoken with a
couple of
brokers who represent 36 or 38s about trading my boat and am
informed that
my boat is worth only 60% of what I paid for it 3 years ago
(despite many
$$$ improvements).

My head says that since everyone needs to make $ in a transaction
the only
way to do this is to sell my boat first and then explore Freedoms.
Tell me
I’m wrong but I fear I’m right.

Ed (a future Freedom owner)

jsforgey1 · April 26, 2007, 9:55am

Posted by jsforgey@… (jsforgey@…)

Sounds like a great idea…I am coming!

It will give me a reason to go voyaging.

Scott
Girlfriend F-32See what’s free at AOL.com.

lance_ryley · April 26, 2007, 11:31am

Posted by lance_ryley (lance_ryley@…>)

I’d like to add a few cents worth of advice based on my own experience:

Create a new email account with one of the free services - you’re
going to want to dispose of it when this is all said and done.
When you create your new email account, you may not want to use
Yahoo. apparently, yahoo email accounts are blocked by a LOT of spam
filters.
Any email that says or implies that they’re willing to buy sight
unseen, or that they have a paid agent to come look, or a money order
that is made out for more than the purchase price (for any reason -
transportation expenses, survey costs, because they just gosh darn like
you) is 99.9% a scam. If you’re a good citizen, you’ll go through the
process of forwarding the email with headers to “abuse@…”. Otherwise,
you’ll just delete it.
If you have created a website with what you consider to be a
complete and fair representation of your vessel, and you get emails
asking for more details of the boat and to see pictures of it, 99.9%
chance it is a scam. Many of the ‘scam-bots’ will scan through
classifieds and then they just generate the email to you - no real
person has seen or knows the first thing about your boat.
If you decide to list with Good Old Boat classifieds, you get a
magazine ad and a free web ad. In the web ad, don’t include your email
address unless it is obfuscated (my.email AT yahoo dot com or something
similar). I started receiving my heaviest volume of spam after my
listing went live there. If I had really won all of the lotteries and
helped all the deposed dictators and widows who have come through my
Inbox, I’d be writing to you from New Zealand right now.
American Boat Listing may have a great service. I don’t know,
because I got fed up with their persistent emails and phone calls
(the ‘do not write with commercial ventures’ option on craigslist is
apparently just a suggestion). Worse, they don’t remember that they’ve
called you already and you’ve said “I’ll think about it” or “no, thank
you.” They left me with a bad taste in my mouth. I can’t say for sure
they’re scam artists, but their website is pretty much unsearchable.
At the end of the day, the best form of contact is either a phone
call or face to face. Don’t get your hopes up too much from an email.
Keep your sense of humor.

Lance
Bright Star
— In FreedomOwnersGroup@yahoogroups.com, “Dave_Benjamin”
<dave_benjamin@…> wrote:

Edward,

Sell the Pearson yourself. 90% plus of the brokers should be avoided.
The good ones are far and few between.
Unless you grossly overpaid for your Pearson you should be able to
recover a good portion of what you paid.
I would sell the Pearson now going into summer and then look for a
Freedom after the season. Winter prices are usually lower.

michel.capel · April 26, 2007, 12:27pm

Posted by michel.capel (michel.capel@…>)

Lance,

Whadaya want to go to New Zealand for?? ;^P

michel

— In FreedomOwnersGroup@yahoogroups.com, “lance_ryley”
<lance_ryley@…> wrote:

I’d like to add a few cents worth of advice based on my own
experience:

Create a new email account with one of the free services -
you’re
going to want to dispose of it when this is all said and done.

When you create your new email account, you may not want to use
Yahoo. apparently, yahoo email accounts are blocked by a LOT of
spam
filters.

Any email that says or implies that they’re willing to buy
sight
unseen, or that they have a paid agent to come look, or a money
order
that is made out for more than the purchase price (for any reason -

transportation expenses, survey costs, because they just gosh darn
like
you) is 99.9% a scam. If you’re a good citizen, you’ll go through
the
process of forwarding the email with headers to “abuse@”.
Otherwise,
you’ll just delete it.

If you have created a website with what you consider to be a
complete and fair representation of your vessel, and you get
emails
asking for more details of the boat and to see pictures of it,
99.9%
chance it is a scam. Many of the ‘scam-bots’ will scan through
classifieds and then they just generate the email to you - no real
person has seen or knows the first thing about your boat.

If you decide to list with Good Old Boat classifieds, you get a
magazine ad and a free web ad. In the web ad, don’t include your
email
address unless it is obfuscated (my.email AT yahoo dot com or
something
similar). I started receiving my heaviest volume of spam after my
listing went live there. If I had really won all of the lotteries
and
helped all the deposed dictators and widows who have come through
my
Inbox, I’d be writing to you from New Zealand right now.

American Boat Listing may have a great service. I don’t know,
because I got fed up with their persistent emails and phone calls
(the ‘do not write with commercial ventures’ option on craigslist
is
apparently just a suggestion). Worse, they don’t remember that
they’ve
called you already and you’ve said “I’ll think about it” or “no,
thank
you.” They left me with a bad taste in my mouth. I can’t say for
sure
they’re scam artists, but their website is pretty much
unsearchable.

At the end of the day, the best form of contact is either a
phone
call or face to face. Don’t get your hopes up too much from an
email.

Keep your sense of humor.

Lance
Bright Star
— In FreedomOwnersGroup@yahoogroups.com, “Dave_Benjamin”
<dave_benjamin@> wrote:

Edward,

Sell the Pearson yourself. 90% plus of the brokers should be
avoided.
The good ones are far and few between.
Unless you grossly overpaid for your Pearson you should be able
to
recover a good portion of what you paid.
I would sell the Pearson now going into summer and then look for
a
Freedom after the season. Winter prices are usually lower.

lance_ryley · April 26, 2007, 1:27pm

Posted by lance_ryley (lance_ryley@…>)

Hmm… how about “Freedom Rendevous 2010” ?

— In FreedomOwnersGroup@yahoogroups.com, “michel.capel”
<michel.capel@…> wrote:

Lance,

Whadaya want to go to New Zealand for?? ;^P

michel

michel.capel · April 29, 2007, 10:05am

Posted by michel.capel (michel.capel@…>)

Sounds nice, but I still have to work a few more years and bring up a
few babies… perhaps 2015?

— In FreedomOwnersGroup@yahoogroups.com, “lance_ryley”
<lance_ryley@…> wrote:

Hmm… how about “Freedom Rendevous 2010” ?

— In FreedomOwnersGroup@yahoogroups.com, “michel.capel”
<michel.capel@> wrote:

Lance,

Whadaya want to go to New Zealand for?? ;^P

michel