Replacement mast wedge

TonyB
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Re: Replacement mast wedge

Post by TonyB »

Correct. I suspect a previous owner or yard had put the mast collar down with 5200. The mast pulled leaving the collar and the wedge in the cabin top. We had removed all nuts and as much caulking as we could. But the Collar and wedge still stayed.
When we stepped the mast we just slid it back in. Clearly that was our mistake.
We will be lifting mast, collar and wedge out and reseating it all. Hopefully this will solve our problem.
Question: did you live the wedge at all? I have read some people apply Vaseline to wedge and others leave it dry.
Tony
SV Circe 1997 Freedom 40/40 - Hull #20 - Richmond Yacht Club, Richmond, CA

Clemson
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Re: Replacement mast wedge

Post by Clemson »

I left mine dry, but it took a serious beating with mallets in order to get it flush, so I think a little lube is probably a good idea provided that you wipe away the squeezeout, and get it fully seated, because addition Vaseline squeezeout would be bad if it interfered with the sealant. I used 3M Marine 5200 and was warned not to apply more than enough to make a consistent seal with just a little squeeze out around the collar because it can otherwise be very hard to unstep in the future.

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jamesorr
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Re: Replacement mast wedge

Post by jamesorr »

I have also left mine dry -- although your mileage may vary :-). I have found that by starting from one end and working my way around, I can get it very close to level with the deck ring (within an 1/8" at least). Also, I stay away from 5200 for anything I might need to separate in the future (which means most things ;-). Therefore, I put a bead of marine silicone around the outer edge of the base ring and then lower/bolt the collar down to the base ring, and smooth any squeeze out -- which makes it easy to pull the collar up in the fall. For the upper collar to mast joint, lately, have been using the 4 inch wide white flex tape with large hose clamps on the mast and collar -- which has done a decent job keeping water out of that gap and looks "ship shape and in bristol fashion".
James Orr
Orr What
1988 Freedom 32 (Mull)
Sodus Bay, NY

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gamayun
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Re: Replacement mast wedge

Post by gamayun »

Hey Tony, I've been meaning to chime in here for a while now. It looks like you're getting a lot of good feedback. It is interesting to hear of different perspectives. As you know, my mast got a wedgie going to Hawaii and back. I think it was because I did something really stupid at the yard when we re-stepped the mast. I include several pictures here to try to illustrate what I think happened. Maybe something will trigger a thought for how you might address your wedge issues. Before we left, I was "helping" the yard put the mast back in. I now think that I put the wedge back in with the larger side on top. It should have been large side down. DOH! I also believe I have the original 1988 ring so it has gotten a little worn over the years. When the yard lowered the mast, it stuck on the wedge with the mast a few inches above the tophat. They sprayed dry lube and hammered the wedge back in place enough to set the mast down but in retrospect, I should have had them pull the mast back up, lube the wedge, and then lower it back in place. Maybe THEN I would have caught my error but not sure because I was pretty sure at the time the wedge should be larger at the top. (This is why I am a biologist and not an engineer.) Anyway, the small piece of the wedge in this first picture shows a cross angle of the ring after 5400 ocean miles and after it had rotated AROUND the mast at least once during the 40 days at sea. You can see it is almost flat and no longer really wedge-shaped. The second picture shows the wedge where it should be tucked up inside the collar. I am pretty sure it shows the large side up when it should have been down. DOH, DOH, DOH! I never had any issues before with the ring except I would occasionally get a little slippage, but it was not so much that I couldn't just push it back up in place. With the wedge the wrong way and when the mast was moving, particularly when using a poled-out spinnaker (for the first time on Kynntana), it was easily slipping out and making a horrible squeak, which was not easy to push back in place unless we could get on a tack with a lot of pressure on the mast to open up the gap. We managed to deal with this on the way to Hawaii., then I tried another method to secure the ring in place with a ratchet strap and a piece of heavy rubber for the return trip. I put the strap up as far up as possible on the mast inside the cabin except there is that "fiberglass lip" that I believe is mostly cosmetic to hold up the headliner. The ring kept wanting to spit out, but the ratchet strap mostly held it in place. However, the third picture shows the damage it wrought after three weeks on the return with the fiberglass lip starting to break from the outward pressure. As to the original ring that you had asked about in an earlier post, mine was cut so there is a gap on one end. I think this is normal. The whole set up does nothing to prevent water from coming in so that is a constant problem. I use mast tape, but it doesn't hold up very long at sea. My v-berth was just one big wet mess with a waterfall coming down the mast from the water we were taking over the bow. I plan to try neoprene rubber and bands next time. There is a YouTube video with one Freedom showing how they replaced the ring with Spartite. I am thinking of doing this along with very liberal mold release although that still makes me nervous. I am also going to put more fiberglass underneath to reinforce that area where the lip was breaking away. I don't need those bolts from the collar to start giving way. I will probably have to cut out the bad ring because I don't want to take the mast off again, but we'll see how that goes. Anyway, maybe some of this sheds some light on the issues you're having. I would also appreciate anyone who wants to sanity check the above approach to keep me from making more work on myself!
Mast wedge after PacCup return_9-16-22.jpg
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Mast wedge up inside the collar_9-16-22.jpg
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Mast wedge coming out of the base_9-16-22.jpg
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Kynntana, Freedom 38

TonyB
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Re: Replacement mast wedge

Post by TonyB »

Hey Carlianne,
I had Jim Antrim, Cree Partridge and Ruben Gabriel out for a sail last week. We all agreed that my very significant noise was coming from the partners and it isn’t seated correctly. Mostly that my wedge isn’t driven in far enough. But it might be that it is worn as well.

The wide part of the wedge should be up. I actually found some good stuff in the Freedom 36/38 owners manual online. I will post the snapshots here.

Once the mast is in, and the wedge is driven into place, the base of the ring (collar) needs to be caulked and set. Then the gap between the ring (collar) and mast above the wedge needs to be filled with caulk. Then we used mast boot tape and had very little leaking. Even with the mast wedge not fully seated.

It certainly looks like your cabin top will need to be addressed. It forms the seat for the wedge.

I think the east Coast sailors who pull their masts every season have gotten good at this and the yards are fairly familiar with it. On the west coast our masts only come out every 10-20 years! And there are a lot fewer Freedoms. So we are learning the hard way :-(.

We are pulling and restepping the mast soon. I will post what I learn.
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Tony
SV Circe 1997 Freedom 40/40 - Hull #20 - Richmond Yacht Club, Richmond, CA

TonyB
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Re: Replacement mast wedge

Post by TonyB »

I just noticed in the drawing that there is a separate ring and collar. 2 pieces. So I was probably wrong about that and just never saw the ring set in the cabin top because the collar never came off. I have been using the terms interchangeably. I have always meant collar!
Tony
SV Circe 1997 Freedom 40/40 - Hull #20 - Richmond Yacht Club, Richmond, CA

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