Posted by Dennis Gunn (dutchharborconanicut@…>)
My wife and I are about to make an offer on a cat ketch 28. Unfortunately since the boat is on shore and the owner has no plans to put the boat in the water, . a sea trial is out of the question. So we really don’t know if a c-k 28 sails straight up or on her ear, since we’ve never been on one.If anyone can tell us how tender the 28 might be, we’ld appreciate it. Also, the surveyer found moisture indicating core deterioration in the transom. He did not seem overly concerned, as long as we rebedded all the fittings aft, to stop any further damage. Any comments or advice would be appreciated before we sign on the dotted line. Dennis Gunn
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Posted by Alan Kusinitz (akusinitz@…>)
I have an F-33 and have not sailed on an
F-28. There are some posting regarding the F-28 and its seaworthiness. I would
guess that the cat ketch rig is quite forgiving as on mine. As the wind picks
up the masts bend and spill the wind so the vessel does stay on its feet if the
sheets are not kept way oversheeted.
As for the core issues if the wet areas
are small it is relatively easy to cut or grind back the balsa and fill with
epoxy and redrill through the epoxy and then reinstall and rebed. If it is a
larger area it is still fixable but more work. If large areas of the hull are
rotting that is a different issue and much more work to resolve. Generally
balsa rots very slowly even when wet. I’ve only had minor issues on mine
although the previous owner had a few cabin top and transom issues that
required replacement of a square foot or two of core.
Alan Hull #51 1982
From: freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com [mailto:freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Dennis Gunn
Sent: Saturday, July 01, 2006 3:15
PM
To: freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [freedomyachts2003] cat
ketch 28
My wife and I are about to make an offer on a
cat ketch 28. Unfortunately since the
boat is on shore and the owner has no plans to put the boat in the
water, . a sea
trial is out of the question. So we really don’t know if a c-k 28 sails
straight up or on her ear, since we’ve never been on one.If anyone can tell us
how tender the 28 might
be, we’ld appreciate it. Also, the surveyer found moisture
indicating core deterioration
in the transom. He did not seem overly concerned, as long as we
rebedded all the
fittings aft, to stop any further damage. Any comments or advice would
be appreciated
before we sign on the dotted line.
\
Dennis Gunn
Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great
rates starting at 1¢/min.
\
Posted by Jerome Weinraub (zayde@…>)
Accepting any boat without a sea trial is a gamble.You need to evaluate the engine,rig,steering and hull in use… All systems require testing,and the only way is afloat.BTW,the Freedom ketches,at least,as I cannot speak for the sloops and schooner hulls,are initially tender,but harden up .
----- Original Message -----
From: Dennis Gunn
To: freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, July 01, 2006 3:14 PM
Subject: [freedomyachts2003] cat ketch 28
My wife and I are about to make an offer on a cat ketch 28. Unfortunately since the
boat is on shore and the owner has no plans to put the boat in the water, . a sea
trial is out of the question. So we really don’t know if a c-k 28 sails straight up or on her ear, since we’ve never been on one.If anyone can tell us how tender the 28 might
be, we’ld appreciate it. Also, the surveyer found moisture indicating core deterioration
in the transom. He did not seem overly concerned, as long as we rebedded all the
fittings aft, to stop any further damage. Any comments or advice would be appreciated
before we sign on the dotted line.
Dennis Gunn
Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min.
Posted by Dave_Benjamin (dave_benjamin@…>)
Was the surveyor recommended by the broker? Sure sounds that way.
What were the readings like? If the core is wet you have to do
something about it or it will eventually rot. Just fixing the leaks
will not fix the problem. It is possible in some cases to repair the
core but it cannot be left unattended. If it’s just small areas you
might be able to dry it out a bit and then inject Git-Rot or similar
treatment.
I would deduct a certain percentage of the boat’s value for not
being able to sea trial. You have no way of knowing how the
drivetrain performs. During a sea trial you can note performance,
vibration, engine abnormalities, prop problems, etc. Why does the
owner not want to launch the boat? It’s summer assuming you’re in
the northern hemisphere. I’d keep looking or knock a big chunk off
the price. If you have no way of running the engine and it’s old,
tired looking, and perhaps has not been maintained budget for an
overhaul. You just have no way of knowing. One possibility is they
guy is broke and can’t afford to launch the boat. Here’s how to find
out.
Assuming the boat is in a yard with nearby travelift offer to split
the cost of a splash and haul. If he won’t do that the boat probably
has major defects or he is not serious about selling.
I wouldn’t pay much for an old 28 without a sea trial. Make him a 2
part offer. You’ll pay X if you can perform a sea trial. You’ll pay
X/2 without a sea trial. See what he says. If he has confidence in
his boat he’ll do a sea trial. I’d also talk to some other surveyors
and see what they think about leaving wet core unattended. We looked
at a boat recently that is probably not economically repairable due
to core problems. A yard quoted 20-25K for repairs and that’s
roughly what the boat would be worth if it didn’t have those issues.
Never never never get emotionally involved in the purchase. Force
yourself to stand back and objectively review the situation. If it
was January in Chicago not doing a sea trial is reasonable. Today is
July 1st.
— In freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com, Dennis Gunn
<dutchharborconanicut@…> wrote:
My wife and I are about to make an offer on a cat ketch 28.
Unfortunately since the
boat is on shore and the owner has no plans to put the boat in
the water, . a sea
trial is out of the question. So we really don’t know if a c-k
28 sails straight up or on her ear, since we’ve never been on one.If
anyone can tell us how tender the 28 might
be, we’ld appreciate it. Also, the surveyer found moisture
indicating core deterioration
in the transom. He did not seem overly concerned, as long as we
rebedded all the
fittings aft, to stop any further damage. Any comments or advice
would be appreciated
before we sign on the dotted line.
Dennis Gunn
Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls.
Great rates starting at 1¢/min.
Posted by lance_ryley (lance_ryley@…>)
I can’t speak specifically to the 28, but Bright Star (when the
sails are properly balanced) generally goes to a 15 degree heel and
stays there. It’s not a tender boat at all. The 28’s are definitely
pretty, and I imagine they’ve got similar handling characteristics.
The other opinions about getting some sort of sea trial, however, is
important. You want to know that systems like the engine and all
seacocks are functional.
Good luck with your search!
Lance
Bright Star
— In freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com, Dennis Gunn
<dutchharborconanicut@…> wrote:
My wife and I are about to make an offer on a cat ketch 28.
Unfortunately since the
boat is on shore and the owner has no plans to put the boat in
the water, . a sea
trial is out of the question. So we really don’t know if a c-k
28 sails straight up or on her ear, since we’ve never been on one.If
anyone can tell us how tender the 28 might
be, we’ld appreciate it. Also, the surveyer found moisture
indicating core deterioration
in the transom. He did not seem overly concerned, as long as we
rebedded all the
fittings aft, to stop any further damage. Any comments or advice
would be appreciated
before we sign on the dotted line.
Dennis Gunn
Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls.
Great rates starting at 1¢/min.
Posted by Andrew (av8av8r@…>)
I have owned and happily sailed an F28 CK for the last 3.5 years on
the Pamlico sound in eastern NC. I found it to be a very well
handling boat overall and not tender by any standard. The rig trims
beautifully and is especially easy to handle single handed.
I would encourage you to ask for a sea trial to see for yourself
(and to check all other systems as previously mentioned), but should
that not be an option you can be assured that you are in for no
surprises or unpleasant tendencies.
When I went through the survey on mine, the surveyor also noted
delamination in the transom. I seem to recall however that the
balsa laminate does not run full width across the stern and it was
the change in density that led the surveyor to his conclusion.
Ultimately it was deemed a non issue. Whether or not this conclusion
was true I don’t know, but I have not yet had any related problems.
Good luck if you do make the buy, you should enjoy her immensely.
Sadly I am presently in the process of settling with my insurance
company over mine following extensive damage to the hull from a
severe storm that blew through a couple of weeks ago.
Cheers - Andrew
— In freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com, “lance_ryley”
<lance_ryley@…> wrote:
I can’t speak specifically to the 28, but Bright Star (when the
sails are properly balanced) generally goes to a 15 degree heel
and
stays there. It’s not a tender boat at all. The 28’s are
definitely
pretty, and I imagine they’ve got similar handling
characteristics.
The other opinions about getting some sort of sea trial, however,
is
important. You want to know that systems like the engine and all
seacocks are functional.Good luck with your search!
Lance
Bright Star
— In freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com, Dennis Gunn
<dutchharborconanicut@> wrote:My wife and I are about to make an offer on a cat ketch 28.Unfortunately since the
boat is on shore and the owner has no plans to put the boat in
the water, . a sea
trial is out of the question. So we really don’t know if a c-k
28 sails straight up or on her ear, since we’ve never been on
one.If
anyone can tell us how tender the 28 might
be, we’ld appreciate it. Also, the surveyer found moisture
indicating core deterioration
in the transom. He did not seem overly concerned, as long as
we
rebedded all the
fittings aft, to stop any further damage. Any comments or
advice
would be appreciated
before we sign on the dotted line.Dennis Gunn
Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls.
Great rates starting at 1¢/min.