RE: Re: Cat Ketch sailing around at anchor

Posted by Brian Guptil (sailordude@…>)

Gentlemen

The reason sailboats, and powerboats as well, sail-about at anchor is the center of lateral effect of the hull, deck, masts and, well everything sticking it the airstreams is forward of the center of lateral effect of the hull, keel and rudder. This is desirable if you want the boat to “round up” when you release the helm, (a very important safety feature). In aircraft, they call this feature, “inherent stability”, If you trim the airplane to fly level, reduce engine speed, the aircraft will pitch down, seeking the SPEED. at which it was trimmed. If you advance the throttle, the nose will pitch up, again, to try and achieve the speed for which the aircraft was trimmed. Same is true on a boat, when you trim the boat for balance, and lock the rudder in place. The boat will maintain that balance until the wind speed changes, at which time, the boat will turn into or away from the wind, (slowly at first) to again achieve the same boat speed. As long as it can achieve that speed, it will sail on.

On a cat ketch, it is easy to see that the windage is well forward. The main is almost at the bow, forward of the keel. Where the mizzen has little effect on windage since it is very near the center of lateral resistance in water. You can achieve “inherent stability” by placing the center of the windage AFT of the pivot point. by Anchoring by the stern. Or fly a stabilizing sail well aft, or on ketches fly a small mizzens set the sail, sheeting to the centerline.

The test is to anchoring by the stern, in winds high enough where the boat would be expected to swing, if anchored “bow too.”

I have used this technique in an extreme, by anchoring in (by the stern) 180 feet of water so as to act as one end of a starting line. If your boat makes up one end of the start line, you can’t be wondering about, in the wind. IN the two days I did this, the wind typically increased to 20 on the afternoon and the boat was stable on the line.

Brian -

Posted by Tom Vesey (tvesey@…>)
I keep my F44 on a heavy chain mooring. When Hurricane Florence came through Bermuda last September - a relatively mild hurricane with winds up to maybe 80 knots where the boat was – I was alarmed to see how much the boat was tacking back and forth… creating an awful lot more windage, and an awful lot more strain on the chain and harness than if she was sitting politely head to wind. Maybe a tiny (and very strong) Y-shaped riding sail would be worth trying for a situation like this.Tom Vesey"Jackrabbit"BermudaOn Feb 10, 2007, at 11:23 AM, andre laviolette wrote: The technique that seems to work best to stop the hunting, is to anchor "Bahamian " style, i.e. 2 anchors. One to port and one to starboard BUT almost 180 degrees apart. (160 * ? ) Both long rodes ( heavy is better ) are the brought in quite tight ! Not the best for holding but it keeps the bow in one spot.Brian Guptil <sailordude@brigup.com> wrote: My current Freedom and the two before it, hunted. The 44, with 230ft chain in front of 300ft nylon, but anchored 7:1 in 10ft, starts hunting at 12 to 15. By 40mph I need to put the engine in “Reverse” at about 1,000RPM, which keeps the boat from moving up-wind on the radius of the anchoring circle. I wonder what I am doing wrong. If I didn’t do the engine thing, when the bow fell through the eye of the wind, the chain would go slack. Brian All new Yahoo! Mail Get news delivered. Enjoy RSS feeds right on your Mail page.

Posted by webmaster (akusinitz@…>)



I’ve thought about a small riding
sailing flown using the mizzen halyard like a topping lift.
Alan





From: freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com [mailto:freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tom Vesey
Sent: Saturday, February 10, 2007
12:06 PM
To: freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [freedomyachts2003]
Re: Cat Ketch sailing around at anchor




I keep my
F44 on a heavy chain mooring. When Hurricane Florence came through Bermuda last September - a relatively mild hurricane with
winds up to maybe 80 knots where the boat was – I was alarmed to see how much
the boat was tacking back and forth… creating an awful lot more windage, and
an awful lot more strain on the chain and harness than if she was sitting
politely head to wind.



Maybe a tiny (and very strong) Y-shaped riding sail would be worth
trying for a situation like this.

\



Tom Vesey


“Jackrabbit”


Bermuda


\


\



On Feb 10, 2007, at 11:23 AM, andre laviolette wrote:







The
technique that seems to work best to stop the hunting, is to anchor
"Bahamian " style, i.e. 2 anchors. One to port and one to starboard
BUT almost 180 degrees apart. (160 * ? ) Both long rodes ( heavy is better )
are the brought in quite tight ! Not the best for holding but it keeps the bow
in one spot.

Brian Guptil <sailordude@brigup.com>
wrote:




My current
Freedom and the two before it, hunted. The 44, with 230ft chain in front of
300ft nylon, but anchored 7:1 in 10ft, starts hunting at 12 to 15. By 40mph I
need to put the engine in “Reverse” at about 1,000RPM, which keeps
the boat from moving up-wind on the radius of the anchoring circle. I wonder
what I am doing wrong. If I didn’t do the engine thing, when the bow fell
through the eye of the wind, the chain would go slack.

Brian


\





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Get news delivered. Enjoy RSS feeds right on your Mail page.





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Posted by michel.capel (michel.capel@…>)

What you could try, is taking your booms out to the ends of the
travellers. One boom to stbrd, the other boom to port. They create
so windage almost equal on each side and may overcome the
hunting/horsing.

— In freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com, “webmaster”
<akusinitz@…> wrote:

I’ve thought about a small riding sailing flown using the mizzen
halyard
like a topping lift.

Alan


From: freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tom Vesey
Sent: Saturday, February 10, 2007 12:06 PM
To: freedomyachts2003@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [freedomyachts2003] Re: Cat Ketch sailing around at
anchor

I keep my F44 on a heavy chain mooring. When Hurricane Florence
came through
Bermuda last September - a relatively mild hurricane with winds up
to maybe
80 knots where the boat was – I was alarmed to see how much the
boat was
tacking back and forth… creating an awful lot more windage, and
an awful
lot more strain on the chain and harness than if she was sitting
politely
head to wind.

Maybe a tiny (and very strong) Y-shaped riding sail would be worth
trying
for a situation like this.

Tom Vesey

“Jackrabbit”

Bermuda

On Feb 10, 2007, at 11:23 AM, andre laviolette wrote:

The technique that seems to work best to stop the hunting, is to
anchor
"Bahamian " style, i.e. 2 anchors. One to port and one to
starboard BUT
almost 180 degrees apart. (160 * ? ) Both long rodes ( heavy is
better ) are
the brought in quite tight ! Not the best for holding but it keeps
the bow
in one spot.

Brian Guptil <sailordude@…> wrote:

My current Freedom and the two before it, hunted. The 44, with
230ft chain
in front of 300ft nylon, but anchored 7:1 in 10ft, starts hunting
at 12 to
15. By 40mph I need to put the engine in “Reverse” at about
1,000RPM, which
keeps the boat from moving up-wind on the radius of the anchoring
circle. I
wonder what I am doing wrong. If I didn’t do the engine thing,
when the bow
fell through the eye of the wind, the chain would go slack.

Brian


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